Jim Dey: As long as it's a free country ...

Jim Dey: As long as it's a free country ...

Who's in the right? Let us know by submitting a Letter to the Editor here

As the University of Illinois band finished its halftime performance at Tuesday's men's basketball game against Rutgers, the moral reprobates did it again.

"Cccccccccccchhhhhhhhhhhhiiiiiiiiieeeeeefffffff," they yelled in unison.

It was enough to send chills up the spines of their moral superiors, and it surely did.

Why don't Chief Illiniwek supporters just knock it off? Haven't they been told — over and over and over again — that they've been forbidden to speak or think — let alone cheer — about the late, lamented-by-many Chief Illiniwek?

Who do they think they are — free people who live in a free society?

Actually, that's exactly what the supporters of the late Chief Illiniwek think, and they're right.

That's why what they did at Tuesday's game they have done at previous UI athletic contests, and it's what they'll do again in the future.

It makes them feel good to cheer the memory of the famous/infamous UI athletic symbol, and if it sends the hypersensitive anti-Chiefs into orbit, so much the better.

It's all part of a familiar pattern.

UI sports fans invoke his memory, and the anti-Chiefs issue a chorus of outraged denunciations that send the boneless wonders in the UI administration into spasms of backside-covering contortions. They explain that they, years ago, got rid of the despicable racist mascot but, unfortunately, have not yet acquired the powers of mind control to banish his memory from the lower forms of human life who still revere Chief Illiniwek's memory.

In the process, they earn both the scorn of the anti-Chiefs and the contempt of the pro-Chiefs.

What's ironic is that the latest discussion was kicked off by the arrest (formal charges were not filed) of a UI journalism professor who breached the propriety of a State Farm Center men's restroom in an effort to record — well, whatever it was he was trying to record.

It was a classic case of an anti-Chief zealot, Jay Rosenstein, pursuing a pro-Chief zealot, Ivan Dozier, who has dressed up in Chief Illiniwek regalia at UI athletic contests.

It's all quite unofficial — kind of like Unofficial St. Patrick's Day, another UI tradition — and to the horror of faculty fuzzites who thought they did away with the Chief years ago.

Well, they did, and they didn't. Their failure to deposit Chief Illiniwek's memory on the ash heap of history undermines their self-image as truly successful authoritarians.

At any rate, the Rosenstein brouhaha kicked off another round of hand-wringing, to the effect that if the pro-Chiefs, like Dozier, would just knock it off, the anti-Chiefs, like Rosenstein, wouldn't be morally compelled to invade public restrooms, camera at the ready. Once again, the anti-Chiefs adopt the victim's role.

Rosenstein has been put on leave with pay, which Chancellor Robert Jones foolishly argues is not a disciplinary action. Of course it's a disciplinary action, a point he unwittingly made crystal clear when he told the social-justice warriors from the faculty senate that barring Rosenstein from campus is necessary to "protect students."

"I'm not making a judgment call here. ... It's about how do you protect students, how do you protect staff, how do you be very clear and transparent," he said.

Just what's is he protecting students from? Is Rosenstein making the rounds of campus restrooms looking for students or faculty members donning Chief Illiniwek regalia? If not, what's the problem?

(Speaking of Jones, this is a black man who grew up in the heyday of Jim Crow in Georgia. How can he stand listening to faculty and student whiners complain about how "oppressive" Chief Illiniwek and virtually everything else on campus is? He knows they don't know the meaning of the word.)

This is, of course, just another tempest in a teapot that will settle nothing — the two sides are dug in deep. It, too, will pass.

So it shouldn't be long before the professor is back to work, an even bigger hero to his anti-Chief supporters than he was before. And so will those who chant "Cccccchhhhhiiiieeeeffff" at the State Farm Center and Memorial Stadium.

As long as it's a free country and people still can remember their beloved UI symbol, they'll yell both in support of his memory and protest of his banishment. There's nothing the anti-Chiefs can do to stop it.

Jim Dey, a member of The News-Gazette staff, can be reached by email at jdey@news-gazette.com or by phone at 217-351-5369.


News-Gazette.com embraces discussion of both community and world issues. We welcome you to contribute your ideas, opinions and comments, but we ask that you avoid personal attacks, vulgarity and hate speech. We reserve the right to remove any comment at our discretion, and we will block repeat offenders' accounts. To post comments, you must first be a registered user, and your username will appear with any comment you post. Happy posting.

Login or register to post comments

Glock21 wrote on February 01, 2018 at 9:02 am

I probably wouldn't wade into Chief waters too far given the mentality of that debate is worse than a drunken tailgating brawl. But it's worth noting that Dey is using it as cudgel against "the authoritarian left," "social justice warriors," etc in the context of his ongoing support of white nationalism. It has become an effective local area of recruitment for white nationalists and their button up fascist front organizations like Turning Point USA on campus and within the conservative movement.

The official RNC endorsement of a credibly accused pederast under trumpism and its white nationalist (or whatever euphemism they're using now) leaders seems to have them doing what they do best: projecting. We all know what he was doing in that bathroom, as much as they're trying to smear him as a pervert, specifically a favorite far right boogeyman: a NAMBLA member. Just more fascist tactics and propaganda from our own paper that has only increased since a white nationalist took the White House.

Shame on the News-Gazette for printing conspiratorial nonsense better suited for the KKK Crusader.

MarkDibley wrote on February 01, 2018 at 11:02 am

How's the weather over in Dimension B?

Illiniwek222 wrote on February 01, 2018 at 9:02 am

Great article, Jim. The anti-Chiefers won't be happy until the campus stops wearing Chief attire and stops invoking his name at sporting events. This will never happen.

Rosenstein set the anti-Chief movement back years.

auntsonyas wrote on February 01, 2018 at 10:02 am

No Jim, no one has "been told — over and over and over again — that they've been forbidden to speak or think — let alone cheer — about the late, lamented-by-many Chief Illiniwek." Students and faculty are simply asking that a government-funded institution stop supporting an outdated mascot and move on. Fans can still wear and speak and think whatever they like. THE NEWS-GAZETTE NEEDS TO STOP TRYING TO KEEP THIS TOWN DIVIDED JUST FOR THE SAKE OF SELLING NEWSPAPERS.


Illiniwek222 wrote on February 01, 2018 at 11:02 am

The town is at least 85 to 15 pro-Chief. Maybe higher.

wayward wrote on February 01, 2018 at 12:02 pm


ROB McCOLLEY wrote on February 01, 2018 at 12:02 pm
Profile Picture

I'd expect it's true within his social group. But yeah,. I'd like to see the data.

My friend Loren Tate also employs that talking point in his Chief articles, but I'm not sure why. No civil rights struggle in history has striven to enact a policy that's already universally popular. For that matter, there's never been a 4th Amendment case that freed an innocent person.

honor9chief wrote on February 01, 2018 at 3:02 pm

Take another vote. It won't happen because socialists loathe democracy. They expect you kiss their ring as they pass by. They are never held accountable like the attack of the symbol of our proud state SYMBOL. And rosenstein using his greater than thou look at me perv. Didn't know he got his start in journalism by writing those cool sayings on the bathroom walls.

rsp wrote on February 06, 2018 at 8:02 pm

Apparently you are misinformed. Our state has 18 symbols, all voted on. How's that for democracy?

They are the White Oak, the Violet, Big Bluestem, Popcorn, White-tailed Deer, Northern Cardinal, Monarch Butterfly, Bluegill, Eastern Painted Turtle, Fluorite, Drummer's Silty Clay Loam, Tully Monster Fossil, State Flag, the song "Illinois, Illinois", Illinois State Seal, the slogan Land Of Lincoln, and the Square Dance.

These are all real things, unlike the chief. The chief is someone in a costume. Whatever you ascribe to the chief is imaginary. Just empty clothes.

lebloom wrote on February 03, 2018 at 7:02 pm

I’ll tell you one thing.  I was never an Illini fan and I’ve lived here in CU all of my life.  But ever since a few people have tried to tell the majority to stop cheering on the Chief that has changed my feelings.  There’s nothing racist about the chief but you’re going Blow off and tell us you know better and Chief Illini is a racist symbol. That idiot Rosenstein had no right whatsoever to go into the men’s room videoing like he did and the States Attorney should’ve pressed charges but she’s so Chicken Chit of the U of I.  If you don’t like what the Pro Chiefers do or say move go down to Florida and tell them and see what they’ll do.  

CallSaul wrote on February 03, 2018 at 8:02 pm

I love these stories about people who say 'I only became pro 'chief' because those uppity anti 'chief' people offended me so gosh darn much.'

It's the same species as the very --- forgive me --- very very specious fantastical portraits of all those mythical otherwise reasonable and rational people who 'only voted for Trump because those gosh darn people who criticize Trump so gosh darn much are so gosh darn mean, gosh darn it all and aww shucks and golly gee gosh darn...'

...I ain't buying...


Objective Reporter wrote on February 01, 2018 at 11:02 am

Well-written article.  It does a good job of summarizing the situation.

PortlandIllini wrote on February 01, 2018 at 12:02 pm

As I understand it,  the University is forbidden to use or promote the Chief or any Indian symbols.  Yet it still retains the copyrights on these trademarks in order to 'protect the intellectual property' of the University.  That is , it  prevents anyone else from using the Chief symbol.

Why not relinquish all rights to these symbols and let them lapse into the public domain?   Then any company could print Chief T-shirts and people could freely express their opinions?  


rsp wrote on February 06, 2018 at 8:02 pm

Because anyone could use the image and use it in deragatory ways. Even if it became public domain it would still be associated with the UI.

zuppke wrote on February 01, 2018 at 12:02 pm

What is lost in the debate over the Chief is the true plight of our Native American bretheren.  These statistics are staggering and I would argue that if we cared more about addressing these issues as compassionate human beings, the issue of being racist or not would disappear:

Poverty Rate:

Native Americans  - 28.3%
All others - 15.5%

College Graduation Rate:

Native Americans - 9.3%

All others - 20.3%

Unemploment Rate:(2014)

Native Americans - 11.3%

All others 5.3%

Alcoholism rates 510% higher than all others

Suicide rate 62% higher than all others

Traffic fatalities 167% higher than all others

Do you really think the burning issue is whether we wear a t-shirt with an image of a chief?  Do you think Native Americans on the Pine Ridge Reservation are holding their breath about the outcome of this trivial argument? Have you ever visited a reservation first hand to witness this tragedy?

We can do better than watch the demise of an entire race of people.  At that point there will be no one to care about whether we are racist or not.  By the way, this is not a liberal vs. right wing issue, it is a human being issue.



annabellissimo wrote on February 01, 2018 at 5:02 pm

Yours is the best comment I've read on this subject in a long time. If this "debate" had ever really been about the status of American Indians in the U.S., it might have been/be worthwhile, but it is about the smug, self-righteous pomposity of those who are making careers and winning popularity points in the arena of self-righteous groupthink. The University of Illinois could offer free tuition, 100% free all-expenses paid, education to American Indian students; they could tutor, mentor, foster and recruit on reservations; they could enlist American Indians to develop a "vetted" symbol and behavior - or any number of other ideas that might indicate a genuine concern for American Indians, not just for those who self-declare that they speak for American Indians! Michigan, which has numerous Indian reservations within its borders and a fairly large Indian population, offers free education to its public colleges and they have had various joint agreements with community colleges, 4-year and tribal leadership to promote college education (and earlier education). UIUC, by bowing to the demands about the Chief implicitly admitted to racism. But the arguments have never been satisfactorily debated in public; the declaration that the Chief was racist and a "mascot" was rejected by those who did not/do not see it that way. Open minds can be changed, but there was never any honest, open, genuinely open-minded/open-hearted debate involving all sides and viewpoints, including American Indians as well as non-Indians. It becomes a conversation of "what the Chief means to me" versus "why the Chief is racist," "why the Chief is not racist", "why the Chief is a mascot" "why the Chief is not a mascot", etc. Those who support the Chief seem to believe that the "racist mascot" was shoved down their throats and they have been declared racists themselves by those who have the ear of power. They not only are defending "the Chief" but they are defending themselves against accusations they feel are wrong. Just because the anti-Chief shouters declared that the Chief is a racist mascot did not convince those who do not see the Chief that way. If the anti-Chief supporters want to change MINDS, they had better develop better ways of teaching, of explaining, of persuading. Bullying and yelling and threatening and always calling on "Mom/the AAUP, the NCAA" to make the "bad brother" behave is not going to change minds. Your excellent information shows the real world of American Indian reservation life, and not even perhaps the whole devastated story. Chief supporters do not see how banning "the Chief" does one single thing to make any improvements to American Indian life. Chief opponents have done nothing to show any link. It is a stand-off that never gets resolved. A public debate with many voices, moderated and fairly conducted by wise and neutral moderators, held free of charge in the Assembly Hall/State Farm Center, a day-long town hall - something, anything, that invites all voices to participate including NCAA, AAUP, tribal leaders and members, Seminole leaders from Florida who are paid for the "mascot" imagery, all "comers" invited and heard - and then a vote. Something, anything that actually reflects the intelligence and intellectual integrity of a (once) great university. Use mediators, use any wise, experienced conflict resolver - but let's get this fixed so we ALL know we have been heard and that the outcome makes sense.

Respect where it is deserved wrote on February 01, 2018 at 12:02 pm

Oh, Mr. Dey! Do you not realize that typing the phrase, "There's nothing the anti-Chiefs can do to stop it" is a completely false statement? Your article can be used to promote harmony, reason and respect or it can be used to sensationalize and belittle. You chose the latter. Much can be done, starting with people merely saying, "this is wrong." As a journalist you should realize that words start revolutions. It is true that not every CHIIIIIEEEEFF chant will be silenced. There will always be people more willing to continue support of a memory they hold dear than to succumb to the realization that their support of that mascot back in the day (unknowing to them at the time) was racist. No one likes looking back on their actions and realizing that they should have chosen a different one. Some will mature by taking a "live and learn" stance, stopping the chanting and deciding to act differently in the future by respecting the beliefs and feelings of others. In the mean time, all we can do is state the facts that the chief IS a racist mascot. And THAT is what the "anti-Chiefs" can do to stop it - one person at a time. By the way, it seems you have missed the point by calling this group of people "anti-Chiefs." This is not about the chief. This is about respecting the structure, traditions and beliefs of a group of Americans by not putting forth racist caricatures of their culture.

Illiniwek222 wrote on February 01, 2018 at 1:02 pm

So it continues...The anti Chiefs love talking down to Chief supporters from their lofty moral high ground., hoping against hope the the Illiniwek supporters will "succumb" to the anti-Chief rants.

The Chief is a revered symbol of the University and will continue to be so long after Kaufman's last effort to ban the 3-in-1, or Rosenstein's last mens room video.

Respect where it is deserved wrote on February 01, 2018 at 2:02 pm

It is not my fault if you feel like you are beneath others. Perhaps if you change where you stand, you would not feel that others are "lofty."

Illiniwek222 wrote on February 01, 2018 at 2:02 pm

Not so much lofty, rather arrogant and misguided.

honor9chief wrote on February 01, 2018 at 3:02 pm

The News Gazette comment section: replete with dueling banjos and toothless cretins. "CHIEEEEEEEEEFFFFFF!!!!!!"

You all lost. Move on.

This is what anti chief people think of us townies. Millions of community dollars supporting that what has become a disgusting place to attend but that school doesn't care about CU, Rantoul, etc and if your feelings for us townies are as reported, I want to ask all my fellow townies to continue to stand down financially. Lets see 300,000 surrounding fellow cretins spend your money elsewhere and support a good well established university. The established university died in 2007. If anyone should understand the plight of his people would be Bobby jones
Are you saying black people don't like native Americans also by his stance on native Americans? Our Symbol is not racist. Racism is if we would insult mr jones by referring him as BUCKWHEAT. that is racist not a student honoring native American culture. We aren't going away. The black race has been bitching for 200 or more years and get a whole month of honoring black people. Jones as it turns out is racist. We just want to cheer our heritage without being attacked. If the players don't care why should we? Take a knee for a good cause. What the hell does the head of the ISG have any clues of our state heritage of native Americans. Don't let them use you as a pawn Step down.

CallSaul wrote on February 01, 2018 at 3:02 pm

Huhhhhhnnn.....yet another out loud and proud blatantly racist 'chief' supporter spewing his racism in public...?

Who could have foreseen such an eventuality...?

Moonpie wrote on February 01, 2018 at 12:02 pm

Free to be racist? Absolutely. After all, the president of the whole country is openly racist.

Jim Dey just wants his Dancin Injun back. I suppose it might make him feel better about being okay with marginalizing non-white people. 

honor9chief wrote on February 01, 2018 at 2:02 pm

How so? I hear nothing but good things from black conservatives. Only hate from the pied piper group following mindless socialists who are anti native Americans

HonDonGerard wrote on February 01, 2018 at 1:02 pm

When I was a kid I was at an Illini game and I distinctly recall most of the crowd seemingly inexplicably began a loud chorus of "boos". 

I asked my Dad why...he said, "because there are five black players in the game and no white players".

It got louder and louder until a white player checked in and then the Assembly Hall erupted into wild cheering.

Can you write about that? Circa 1970 or so...you likely can find a lot of folks around who attended those games at that time.

rsp wrote on February 06, 2018 at 8:02 pm

I seem to recall that.

JohnRalphio wrote on February 01, 2018 at 1:02 pm

Of course it's a free country to smirk and wave your racist symbol around. Of COURSE no one, including the University of Illinois, can make "Chief supporters" stop wearing racist shirts and hiding behind the thin excuse of "tradition." Nothing Mr. Dey is saying is at all news, no matter how hard he tries to make this about the virtue of free speech.

What we all know is that it's about people exercising the right to be racist jerks in public. It's about taking what MIGHT have once been a mascot that people honestly loved, and transforming it into an opportunity to bully and sneer at anyone who questions it. The Chief has become a stand-in for intentional racism, nastiness, and rudeness, appealing to the people who care the LEAST about the actual community of the University, and to immature students who just want to act out.

What Mr. Dey and the N-G CAN'T do is continue to play this game of false equivalencies. If the people violently opposed to the Chief are "snowflakes", then so are the ones violently in favor. Their behavior has become every bit as hypersensitive, obnoxious, and immature as anyone else's, as they cry "Authoritarianism! How dare you tell me what to do!" at the mildest suggestion that fake drums and white people wearing headdresses are racist. 

Mr. Dey The News-Gazette itself have put forth a neverending whining screed that inflames the divide with its overanalysis of every single Chief-related incident, along with sneering jibes at students and faculty. They're part of the problem, and as such they've lost their objectivity, and can no longer be trusted as a local news source.

Innocent_Primate wrote on February 01, 2018 at 1:02 pm

I fail to see what actions of governmental actors (such as the University) implicate First Amendment rights. As far as I can tell, this is not now and never has been a First Amendment issue. If the News-Gazette knows of such illegal actions, it should disclose them immediately. Failing that, I would find it nothing short of contemptible to have such right disingenuously enlisted to paint those with whom we disagree as somehow un-American.

BART15 wrote on February 01, 2018 at 2:02 pm

Racist. Last card in the deck.

CallSaul wrote on February 01, 2018 at 3:02 pm

People who like to make racist comments or who support things like the racist ex mascot always seem to scream that their first amendments rights are being trampled if anyone dares cricitize --- or even accurately describes --- the racism. They feel offended if someone dares to not vehemently support their particular views.

They also complain about somehow supposedly 'not being allowed' to express their racism. That's of course a load of manure, as is demonstrated on a daily basis in the comment sections --- not to mention many editorials --- of the NG. 

They're grievence hoarders who thrive on resentment. They know the old racist 'chief' ex mascot will never be the school's mascot again and they absolutely love their feelings of hatred and resentment over that fact.

They sure do love --- and love harping on --- their various delusional persecution complexes....

Bwp 5P wrote on February 01, 2018 at 4:02 pm

Geez.........I'm nearly 68 years old. Been watching and attending Illini Games since I was probably 8-9 years old!

I always saw THE CHIEF as a reverant symbol of our Heritage. Call me stupid or whatever.......I thought he brought awareness to Indians that once lived here.

Again...apparently I ain't got near the book smarts and Ed-You-Cation as many of you..........but................maybe that's a good thing! I have lived a very comfortable life.....and been a Life Long Supporter of The Fighting Illini!

OrlandoIllini wrote on February 01, 2018 at 4:02 pm

Actually, it appears ‘racist’ is the first card to be played by arrogant leftist elitists. It’s the only card they have. They can’t win anyone to their side of a disagreement simply by saying they are better and more intelligent and more important than other people. So they toss the race card the way FSU’s Chief Osceola tosses a fire-tipped spear (which of course is neither hostile nor threatening). The anti-Chief-ists are trying to correct a wrong that did not exist until they created it by claiming it. They are, after all, the ones who apparently believe that the only good Indian symbol is a dead Indian symbol.


CallSaul wrote on February 01, 2018 at 4:02 pm

Calling accurate description and criticism of racism 'playing the race card' gives your game away... 

OrlandoIllini wrote on February 01, 2018 at 7:02 pm

Not a game, my friend. There is nothing to give away about me other than speaking the truth to angry, hateful people.

CallSaul wrote on February 01, 2018 at 9:02 pm

Look in the mirror for 'angry and hateful.'

When you use the phrase 'playing the race card,' you give away that you do in fact look at it as nothing but a game.

Calling out racism and bigory and hatefullness and resentment is, I assure you, nothing close to a game and you framing it as such does nothing but demonstrate how little respect you have for the targets of the racism and bigotry you would so casually dismiss and insist we all ignore, tolerate and even praise.

That, I can also assure you, is not going to be happening...


JimOATSfan wrote on February 01, 2018 at 4:02 pm

I'm in the Love The Chief camp, as my remnant UofI gear sports a Chief emblem with orange block I on my hat.

For an update on the land of the free concept ... things are trending not so good. Illusion is the word that comes to mind. Check out gaiadotcom to learn. Disclosure is a good thing.


jjohnson wrote on February 01, 2018 at 5:02 pm

Let's get facts straight: the Chiuef was NEVER a mascot. He was protrayed with respect, and while I wish the issue would just go away, I think the arrogance of some of the anti-Chief comments displays a moral failure ('I'm superior to you sub-humans") comparable to racism -- which I do not believe was ever part of supporting the Chief.

CallSaul wrote on February 01, 2018 at 5:02 pm

Yep --- it was a mascot.

It was a racist mascot.

And now it's a racist old ex mascot that won't be the school's racist mascot ever again.

And most of the supporters of the racist old ex mascot are very very arrogant to those of us who oppose the racist old ex mascot --- is that also comparable to racsim...?

CallSaul wrote on February 01, 2018 at 5:02 pm

Brownshoe, great comment!

It was the vulgarity that must not be named in the initialism that got it canned...

calvin wrote on February 01, 2018 at 6:02 pm

does Pekin High School get to reinstate the Chinks........according to this author that would be fine

zip wrote on February 01, 2018 at 9:02 pm

After graduating from the U. of I. in '74, I had a career in the Navy. While stationed at NAS Oceana in Virginia, our squadron had a female Ops Yeoman who had grown up on an Indian reservation in northern Wisconsin. One day she came in to the squadron spaces wearing civilian clothes before changing into her uniform. She was wearing an Illinois sweatshirt with a large Chief emblem on the front. I queried her about it, asking why she would wear it if she felt that the Chief was rascist and denigrating to her tribe (as I had been led to believe by the news stories circulating about the situation back in C-U). She went to great lengths to explain that she and her family and friends still on the reservation had tremendous respect for the Chief and that he was a great SYMBOL of all they stood for; that her brother, still on the reservation, had purchased the sweatshirt and sent it to her to proudly wear; that it was my LIBERAL friends who were ramming this mistaken idea of a rascist mascot down our throats. She actually got emotional talking about it.

CallSaul wrote on February 01, 2018 at 10:02 pm

...so where's the great multitude of pro chicken feather 'chief' actual Indians...?

And no, 'Grandma swears she's 1/32 Cherokee' doesn't count...

Veritas_66 wrote on February 02, 2018 at 5:02 am

Oh no.  I guess I will have to remove Elizabeth Warren from my list.

CallSaul wrote on February 02, 2018 at 10:02 am

Thanks for demonstrating the mindset of the average troll on here who supports the racist old ex mascot...

cjw61822@hotmail.com wrote on February 02, 2018 at 12:02 pm

So if I call out Sen. Warren for NOT being a member of a native tribe  ( which the Native tribe claims they can find nothing to support her statements that she is a member of a tribe) I am racist for point that out?  Is that what your saying there Sollie?


In the mean time...  please explain to me how you would keep people out of SFC who are wearing native costumes?


What if the Honor the Chief society decides to have a pow wow at a game.............. you and the other SJW gonna form a barricade to keep them out?

OrlandoIllini wrote on February 02, 2018 at 6:02 am

As I said, not a game. Reading what I actually wrote might help. Reacting reflexively with unfounded attacks and accusations does not support an argument against what many consider to be an honored and honorable symbol.


CommonSenseless wrote on February 02, 2018 at 7:02 am

OrlandoIllini, meet Saul.  The local, vocal, and anonymous, blow hard that currently resides under any bridge you may cross; a.k.a TROLL. In case you were not aware, everything you do or think that isn't in line with the militant leftist group think he currently exudes makes you a racist, bigot, homophobe and ethno nationalist.  Consider yourself introduced.  

OrlandoIllini wrote on February 02, 2018 at 8:02 am

Thanks. “callsaul” may be another of the monikers used by a commenter who uses several names to spew irrational anger and hate speech. He exhibits no rational thought, or even comprehension of what others actually write. Yet maybe he can do the impossible by naming one person who has actually been injured or harmed by the symbol of Chief Illiniwek… and not liking the symbol is neither injury nor harm.


Objective Reporter wrote on February 02, 2018 at 10:02 am

You've been asSAULted.

CallSaul wrote on February 02, 2018 at 11:02 am

Mindlessly asserting and then re asserting something doesn't make it true, no matter how loudly you repeat the falsehood...

I did read your comment and responded to the ignorant way you try to dismiss criticism of racism as a game, 'playing the 'race card.' By definition, you are framing it as nothing but a game.

Everyone can see that and yet you insist on denying it and spew personal attacks and delusional notions recycled from the last ten years of the rightwing echo chamber.

You'll fit right in with the other rightwing reactionary trolls on here...

The moldy old racist ex mascot it gone. It's never going to be the school's mascot again. It was dumped over 10 years ago.

Grown mature adults would be able by now to deal with it and move on...

But we know the rightwing trolls will never move on from it. It's one of your cherished grievances and you love the feelings of resentment and hatred the racist mascot's canning lets you feel whenever you need a fix.

Rage addiction is terminal...

OrlandoIllini wrote on February 02, 2018 at 11:02 am

So… are you going to name one person who has been injured or harmed by the symbolic Chief?


CallSaul wrote on February 02, 2018 at 1:02 pm

Are you really going to argue that racist stereotypes do no harm to anyone...?

OrlandoIllini wrote on February 02, 2018 at 2:02 pm

It is not racist for the state university to have a symbol of an historic native American people after whom the state is named. If it were, I would support removing it and changing the name of the state.


CallSaul wrote on February 02, 2018 at 2:02 pm

The racist old ex mascot is offensive and, yes, racist. 

Claiming that opposition to the racist old ex mascot requires believing that the name of the state should be changed is specious and ludicrous...

...it doesn't follow...

OrlandoIllini wrote on February 02, 2018 at 3:02 pm

I made no claim that “opposition to the racist old ex mascot requires believing that the name of the state should be changed”. I said what I would do if I thought the symbol was racist, which I do not believe. Please read what is written.


CallSaul wrote on February 02, 2018 at 3:02 pm


jsc224 wrote on February 02, 2018 at 11:02 am

First, the dictionary defines racism as the belief that one race is inferior to another.  Love and admiration for the Chief has nothing to do with such a belief.  Thus, the accusation that the Chief is a racist symbol and that Chief supporters are racist is a monstrous lying libel.
Second, Chief supporters are not hostile or abusive.  To love and admire the beautiful and powerful Chief symbol does not involve hostility or abusiveness.
Third, the existence of the Chief does no harm to Native Americans, and the destruction of the Chief does Native Americans no benefit.
So, the primary foundation of the anti-Chief effort is based on monstrous lies and distortions.
Is there any wonder that support for the Chief continues?  Such support will never die in the face of lies and distortions.

BruckJr wrote on February 02, 2018 at 1:02 pm

Well, that's the dictionary's definition, not Saul's.  

Bwp 5P wrote on February 02, 2018 at 3:02 pm

As someone that is somewhat Verticaly challenged.......I am offended by the Leprachon of Notre Damn! I think it's racist as well as offensive!

I want him eliminated!

JohnRalphio wrote on February 02, 2018 at 4:02 pm

Two seconds of Googling reveals at least one prominent Native American group that explicitly says mascots like the Chief are harmful.


You don't get to claim the Chief is "harmless" just because you personally have warm feelings toward it. You don't get to decide what is or isn't disrespectful to entire groups of people, overriding what those groups have said.

If Chief supporters care so much about honoring Native Americans, perhaps the best solution would be to contact representatives from many Native American groups and let them vote on whether or not the Chief is racist.

That seems like a fair solution. But it would be far simpler to just move on from the Chief, like adults.

cjw61822@hotmail.com wrote on February 02, 2018 at 7:02 pm



Bill was drafted in the AZ legislature prohibiting any banned racist named teams from playing there.


Problem was and is according to the SJW author...........



One tribe can find a symbol racist


another tribe finds the same symbol not.


Us palefaces tend to lump all native americans as one big happy group..................... for thousands of years they were not...........................................they regularly tried to kill each other... hence the name........... Starved Rock......................................


where the Illini were wiped out by the Blackhawks.............


In the mean time............ this is not going to go away until the U of I names a symbol. On the 100th year of the U of I sending soldiers/sailors to the Great war..  time to make the symbol a 1917 doughboy.


after all......... thats where the term Fighting Illini come from.